Season 2, Episode 31

Welcome to the Coaching Studio Podcast

This podcast features fun, lively conversations with masterful coaches who are creating an impact. Get to know them, their journey into coaching, and discover what wisdom they would offer you about being a better coach.

Let’s go!

Mike Green MCC is our guest on the Coaching Studio

the Coaching Studio Guest

I am very excited to welcome Mike Green, MCC, to the Coaching Studio Podcast.

Credits

  • Host: Lyssa deHart, LICSW, MCC
  • Music: Frolic by Harrison Amer
  • Production Editing: Lyssa deHart
  • Social Media and Communications: Michele Logan

About This Episode

Today’s guest is someone who I think you are going to enjoy; I am excited to introduce you to Mike Green, MCC. In our conversation today, we talk about Mike’s adventure into Leadership Coaching, becoming an MCC, and how each coach has to discover how to let go of their baggage, such as the idea of adding value, in order to become the coach their clients need. 

Mike Green’s story reads like something from a Hemingway or Kerouac novel. This guy hitchhiked from New York to Alaska just to prove a point. He believes that leaders are made in the wild. In all environments, no matter how extreme, there is a shared fundamental need: people who are brave enough to discover their leadership truth. Throughout his 30 years of working and traveling around 63 countries throughout all seven continents, he has documented over 11,000 hours of coaching along the way. His book “Wandermust, A Hero’s Journey To Seven Truths” chronicles some of his travels as well as how he coaches clients in the outdoors. Mike utilizes various methods, including dynamic workshops, virtual coaching, face-to-face coaching, and adventure coaching, to help uncover clients’ leadership truths. He earned the Master Certified Coach accreditation from the International Coaching Federation, which is the highest standard for coaching.

Read the transcript of this episode of the Coaching Studio Podcast:

Lyssa deHart

Hello. I’m Lyssa deHart and welcome to The Coaching Studio. Today in the Studio is Master Certified Coach Mike Green. And Mike, I am so excited to have you on the show today. So thank you so much for being here.

Mike Green

I’m grateful to be here. I’m grateful for all that you do for the coaching industry.

Lyssa deHart

Thank you so much. Well, I appreciate hearing that. I’m very excited. I know you had your book come out recently called WanderMust. Um, I’d love to hear sort of a little bit about your journey into coaching. And I have a sense that it started with this wondering that you might have been doing in the world. And I’d love to hear a little bit about this journey that you’ve been on.

Mike Green

Thank you for the question. Yes. Wander must Hero’s Journey to Seven Truths. It’s basically a leadership travel log memoir. Um, and it talks about how I discovered a leadership truth on every continent. For example, I discovered the leadership truth of, um, emotional intelligence in Antarctica or on the continent of Antarctica. So I tell the story of how I arrived there, what I discovered, and how I apply it to my coaching practice. My discovery, that is, because my truth may be different than your truth. And the heroes journey aspect is, of course, referring to the great work of Joseph Campbell. Um, and then the book starts off where I’m coaching an executive client. He is a composite of many coaching conversations I’ve had. I’m coaching a client that comes to Alaska for his capstone Alaska, Leadership Adventure. Take him out into the bush because I have 25 years in the Alaskan bush experience. And he and I go out and, um, he’s completely devoid of all the electronic, distractions. And as I’m coaching Ian, the character, I am m going back in time to all seven continents of how I discovered a leadership truth. And so far, the book is doing very, very well. 52 five-star reviews on Amazon high, um, review on, uh, Kirkus, which is a big deal for any publisher. [Huge] I’m grateful.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah.

Mike Green

Uh, I looked into my wife. I go, I guess I really did write a good book.

Lyssa deHart

It really is. Uh, not everybody knows about Kirkus, but I got a Kirkus review also on my book. And makes, it legitimizes your book in some ways, and I think that’s really profound. So I would really love to hear what led you towards A. Becoming a coach in general, but then to really embark on the journey of becoming a master quality of coaching a masterful coach. What was that journey like for you?

Mike Green

I always knew that I was a servant leader, somebody who supported others as an early teenager. Um, I discovered that when I was in, um, the grocery store with my mother. And back in those days, your parents would talk to other parents as if you’re not there. And my best friend’s mother said, to my mother. You know Mike asked really good questions, and I’ve been thinking about the last question you asked me. It’s just really good, real powerful questions or something like that. My mom said, “He really helps people. He really likes to help people. ” And I wasn’t like an Eddie Haskell type of question. Ask her. I really came from a sincere place of asking the question that seemed to be the right question to ask. So I always knew that I was a servant leader in supporting people’s development. However, as I went into the outward bound world of, uh, experiential education, and then I ultimately went into, um, human development and the leadership and facilitation or communication and hotel, uh, lobbies, et cetera, for not hotel lobby, but hotel conference rooms for oil and gas. That’s when I really started understanding coaching. Because not until I was about 32 years of age that I ever hear of executive coaches or coaching. Um, so I had a mentor, and, uh, she told me about the ICF and how it’s the Gold Standard, et cetera. So I started researching it, and right away, I thought to myself, there’s no way I could do that, because, um, one, I can’t even keep track of my checkbook back in those days, let alone my coaching hours. So, like a good mentor would, they supported me in starting that journey. And why I started that journey at the very beginning is because I knew that I had an innate gift of asking good questions from a sincere place of service. But I didn’t really know the structure of a coaching conversation, quote unquote coaching conversation. Didn’t understand the value of rapport, the value of contracting, the value of action items and checking back and being able to understand the dance, the arts, and the science of the dance of a coaching conversation. Um, so that’s why I want to become a learned student. So I really started off at ground zero, um, with my hours. And I literally have over 11, 000 hours now documented, which is shocking that I can even document it. In that I said, well, if I could document 11, 000 hours of coaching over that, I can write a book. I’m not kidding you. Uh, that was my coaching to myself. Mike, you can do this. You think you couldn’t do it way back in the years of your first started? So that’s how I started becoming a master, is coupled with that deep desire to support people when they’re ready, um, on their own time, in their own space, right? Because I’m a doer. I’m a driven individual. And I, uh, love it because I’m not driven. When I’m in the conversation with a client, I am with them. It’s almost like a respite for me of thinking all the things I need to be doing right now. I’m just completely in a different world. And I’m grateful for that gift.

Lyssa deHart

And it really speaks to me of presence as you’re speaking of your capacity to sort of set to decide all the other checklists and things that you need to be doing to be really fully present with your clients. And it sounds like that may have been part of your innate, um, talent anyway, but was there some element that you really had to cultivate in yourself in order to become more Masterful in your capacity to hold that coaching conversation?

Mike Green

Yes, it was in stages. Um, when I started my ACC level, et cetera, um, at the end of my ACC into my PCC, I had to learn to get out of my own way. It’s not about me. I cannot attach their value, um, of this conversation to my sense, um, of being, or self, or value. Um, and then once I learned that as I went into PCC, that I’m in “service of” and being on service of, I have to devoid myself, of that they get their time worth, it wasn’t a valuable conversation. It’s all about them. So once I learned that, it was great. Then, as a journey through my PCC towards my Master, which I thought at the time I could never get. Um, but I met the right people, like a great friend, Fran Fisher, um, all the great people like her. And she supported me in understanding that I can do this, um, because I did have self-doubt. Because when you hear the Masterful coaches in those calls, you think, wow, they are good. But then I have to understand is that they are good and that’s them. You can be that good and be yourself. So, to answer your question, a long way, and I apologize for being a long wind, but it’s a journey, right? So I’m telling you from the beginning to the end, only until I wrote my book did I truly, I got my Master certification, and I started my book right uh, after that. It allowed me, it helped me step into being a Master Certified Coach and allowing me to be me wherever I was in the coaching conversation with an individual or with a corporation. For example, I work with many high-power, uh, clients that are talking billions of dollars to do things that are mind-boggling. Sometimes that little voice in the backside of my head would say, they’re looking at you thinking, what’s this guy got to offer? Now I go in confidently, it’s like, no, I am me, as a Master, as opposed to trying to be Fran Fisher or, um, others that I’ve heard and I really respect.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah. You know there’s something there that I think is really crucial because I don’t think you’re alone in this arc of like, what is the value that I bring versus “being myself” and that is the value that I bring, which is I’m hearing this part of the arc and letting go of this need to, I don’t know, provide value, but rather being of a value. And I’m curious what allowed you, was there, like, a, um, moment where it kind of hit you between the eyes and you’re like, uh, oh, this is the switch. This is the, um, evolutionary step I need to take, so to say. Um, to let go, uh, of providing value and just being a value?

Mike Green

I can tell you how it felt.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah, I’d love that.

Mike Green

Um, I felt like if I was dancing in that conversation with them, and I wasn’t leading, I was just there. Um, much like when you see the sea grass flowing in the wind, it was like that. Or if you’ve ever seen, like, a lapping of an ocean, it was like that. Or the way in which I live in Alaska, so I see a lot of nature. It was as if, um, Sow Bear nurses or takes care of their cub. It’s a very, um, intimate experience if you just sit with it. And you just watch it as it happened, as opposed to trying to make it happen. Right. So it felt like a dance. I felt really truly like I was part of something greater than myself. There’s a huge honor to that. Huge responsibility.

Lyssa deHart

Yes. I love that image of the sea grass moving with the tides. Right. Uh, it is at the will of the tide that it moves. Right. And in a way, if I’m hearing you correctly, you’re learning to be in that space of being at the will of the client. As to how you, like, they’re leading the dance, and your movements are in response to and in reflection of, uh, the person that you find yourself with. I mean, I could be hearing you wrong, but I think that’s what I’m hearing.

Mike Green

That’s true. Right. And also trust in the ICF credentialing process of coaching conversation, of all the things that you need in order to tell me.

Lyssa deHart

The Competencies, Yeah.

Mike Green

Right. Exactly. So that was a really good important to me, because I’m the type of person, if they want that I’ll do that. I’m kind of like a Forest Gump, but when I first started ACC, I was forcing it.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah.

Mike Green

We can’t go there yet. We haven’t done this. Um, just trust in the flow of the conversation that all those things will take place in, uh, a very powerful coaching conversation with the client. Um, so it was a dance of three things. Right. The trust in the process of a great question, or, uh, coaching call or conversation. Um, and also, what makes that and then also myself. And then dancing with the client.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah. What has been, if you were to name something that was the challenge as, ah, you began this journey that you had to, uh, overcome, beyond even just this idea of your own value, was there something internal around that value that you also had to challenge or confront, or was there something else that was part of that journey?

Mike Green

I had to learn patience and grace with myself. Because normally, when I, um, set a goal, I do everything I can to achieve it the best I can in a period of time that is, uh, a little bit more than just average. So if something took six years, I want to do it in five. For example, just making a number up, a random number, um, I had to know that it’s going to come with time, and it’s patience and grace to have quality, right? True quality. So I searched out, um, um, the Fran Fisher’s later in my career, and the mentors of the ICF in Colorado, and I started my whole journey with Ericsson and Coaching International. Ericsson is a really great group, and I really appreciate the modules and the way they did it. And they were very flexible, and they had great facilitators, and that did it. So I appreciated them and the relationships with all those folks and the support. So I had to be patient and graceful with myself, saying, you can’t rush this. This has just happened organically. And once I did that, then I began slowly, not always easily, and I always gracefully understand that dance, the dance, the value of the dance with the client that, um, you can’t force it. They have to find it themselves. And sometimes calls don’t go so well, and that’s okay. Right? But that’s okay. But being a master, you can always, in theory, bring it right back, bring it around with let’s just take a moment here and let’s just reiterate the intention of this call today. You say something like that to bring somebody off, bring them back to why we’re here in this call, as opposed to back in the day. You would say. Let me go back to.

Lyssa deHart

Let me direct you somewhere so that I know where we are.

Mike Green

Right. Yeah. There will be a big X across my screen now. Big X.

Lyssa deHart

I really think it’s so important to this idea of patience and grace. I personally, just speaking for myself, I can really appreciate that, because I think that for many people, there’s this desire to get to Mastery, and I want to do it as quickly as possible. And I see a lot of young coaches, um, honestly, I see just a lot of coaches looking for the formula. What is the formula? In, in order to become masterful, what would you say to people looking for the formula?

Mike Green

Well, high level, I would say there is no formula because you’re constantly evolving as a coach. Um, that’s a high level. Now, that would be a great topic for, uh, chat with a Mastermind. Right?

Lyssa deHart

It really would be a really interesting conversation.

Mike Green

Um, uh, I would ask them with a question. How do you want to interact with your Master Coach Certification title? When you’re laying in bed at night, or you’re driving down some highway, or you’re going to some conference somewhere, do you want to be able to say, I’m a master coach and feel it grounded? I would want to put my hand on this. I am a Master Certified Coach. I am a father, I am a great husband. I am an awesome neighbor. I can say that with great my tenor in my voice.

Lyssa deHart

I noticed your tenor in your voice Mike.

Mike Green

I, uh, would ask them that because I think that that question, even if they don’t want to answer it now, that will stay with them throughout their journey. And do you want to get a stamp in, rush through at all? Or do you really want to be that Master? That is really important, I think, at least for my journey. Because even though I got my Master, I felt that I was a Master and I deserved it. Absolutely, I deserved it. But only later did I decide did I feel that impostor symptom go away. I belong at this table with these high-level executives that have done amazing things in the world of business. Right? My question is, how do you want to relationship to be with your Master Coach Certification? What does that feel like, sounds like, look like? That would be my question to that person. So I would answer the question with.

Lyssa deHart

The question, well, that’s a good coach, um, and your inquiry. And I think that, I think that’s really what it brings up for me as you ask that question is that’s really all we can ever be is how are we going to be in relationship to the things that we say are important to us? And, um, I don’t know that there’s a fast track to anything that you become masterful at doing. And I think in coaching, that capacity to understand the competencies as well as hold that container of a conversation, and then to bring your own presence into that, right? And your own personality and your own way of speaking into that container is the journey in many ways, um, of Mastery. And it doesn’t matter if the mastery is in, um, woodworking or painting, or painting motorcycles, it just doesn’t even matter. Like, there’s this process that you have to go by where you develop the fundamentals. But then you come out the other side and you can play with the fundamentals in unique and beautiful dancing with the client in the moment. Ah, beautiful. Um, what do you think is different about coaching in your mind now than when you were younger and you had just heard about coaching and you had a sense of what coaching was? What is the difference between where you started and where you are now in the way that you perceive coaching?

Mike Green

Well, when I started, I didn’t understand, um, coaching, my relationship with that, was sports and such. Um, I’m grateful for my journey because I started off an organic way of just learning, um, what it is, the value of it. But what is different? I think that when I started years and years ago, that I don’t even know if Life Coach was even out there that term. And for me, I don’t necessarily identify with that. I guess if I could say it that way. I, um, think there’s a different idea of coaching, because there are so many different types of coaching out there, so to speak, now, and so many people are coaches and go to a Starbucks. There’s a real estate agent, there’s a coach, and there’s a college student at it. Right? I mean, everyone’s a coach now. I’m not devaluing any of those people. Please don’t send me emails. Right? I think that’s why ICF is so very important to, um, me. Me as an individual and as a coach, me as a breadwinner. They have really thought out standards to allow us to be able to go into, uh, relationships with other clients, saying, this is the standard that we go by. And that’s why I charge what I charge because I’ve worked for it. Um, I didn’t go through a traumatic life experience and come out positively on the other end, which is all valuable. So now I’m a coach to talk to people about that experience. And I’m not saying that that’s negative at all, by any means. I’m just saying that the ICF allows that standard. So, to answer your question quickly and succinctly, I think that the value of ICF has grown exponentially since I started in M, the world of coaching. Globally. Um, globally.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah. And I think my take on what you’re saying is something I’m very aligned with, which is literally anybody can call themselves a coach. Right? And that doesn’t negate anything about what it is that they’re offering. But I often see people who call themselves coaches and don’t really understand the competencies. And don’t really know how to hold a coaching conversation. That there’s a lot more consulting education, it’s much more about telling than it is about really pulling out from the client their own internal wisdom. And I know for myself, that was a really interesting shift, uh, as I was working on my MCC, the same sort of thing, as I navigated forward what that actually meant to be coaching versus one of these other absolutely valuable roles that people play, right? Consultant, educator, counseling, um, therapy, like all these different sorts of teaching, all these different roles. But there’s a real distinct difference around what is coaching and how to hold that role also. How do you notice? I hear from a lot of people, you can’t really do that with executives, because executives expect something from you. They expect you to tell them. To come in as an expert. And so I hear people like, I’m an Executive Coach because I was an executive, or I’m a Leadership Coach because I’m an expert on Leadership. What is your thinking on these ideas of expertise and what Executive Coaches are, or what Executives are really needing from Coaching?

Mike Green

My initial thoughts are managing the client expectation. Right? Having that discovery call about why am I here? Why are we having this dialogue right now? What is the value? Um, excuse me? What is the goal in mind? Are you trying to have less pain or you’re trying to go towards more positive? Or whatever, have you? So it’s managing that expectation. Um uh, because I believe the coach, the Master coach, that I very rarely tell. And if I tell something, I will ask permission, and it could be as soft as noticing something, may I give you my thoughts, or can I give you an observation that’s kind of neat about to tell them something? Um, but I have to educate so many of my clients during the discovery call about what a coaching relationship is. Because all of my friends had a coach and they told him a lot of things and gave them a lot of great advice. And I was like, well, I’m not that guy. [Right] that’s not my opinion. Real coaching. So I have to spend a lot of time educating them about what it’s about. And sometimes it’s really difficult for Executives. I literally had one, uh, last week, um, explaining to them that what a coaching relationship should sound like for a true coaching experience. Because, again, he said, my wife had one for this, and one of my, uh, subordinates had one for getting through marriage. And all these times, well, uh, what can I support you in? Why are we having this conversation? And how is that going to look to support your needs, your goals, et cetera? And sometimes it’s very difficult for them to articulate that. And I say, well, that’s exactly why we should be having this conversation. And let’s not be worried about the titles right now. Let’s focus on, um, the relationship and how this relationship can support you. Either A, getting away from something, or going towards something. The NLP model. Then I just try to keep it as simple as possible during that time, because most of the time, they’re very uncomfortable of, wait, uh, a minute. Everything I’ve heard is you tell me it’s valuable, but that’s not going to support you’re not going to do that. So why am I hiring? Right. Then you’re thinking, if you were back in the PCC days, like, oh, my God, I don’t want to lose this client because I need them. Um, right. I got to pay my mortgage. Now as a Master, you say, “Listen, this relationship is going to be whatever is going to be. ” But I can tell you one thing I’m not going to tell you. I’m not going to give advice because I fundamentally believe that you have the answers. You just haven’t been asked that question yet.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah, it’s always such an interesting thing to me when people are like, but I want to know what you would do. And I’m like, well, it doesn’t really matter what I would do, because I’m not you. And I have a whole different set of circumstances and a whole different set of capacities. And I also have to say, I always, ah, sort of, um, find it entertaining that somebody who is leading an organization would believe that somebody outside of the organization could possibly tell them exactly what needs to happen within their organization. They know intimately all the things they’ve tried. They know intimately all the things that have, ah, or haven’t worked, what they are or are not capable of. And I think to your point, having a much richer conversation about, uh, what direction do you want to focus and where do you want to move towards? Is not something any external person can answer for another human being. Right. So how do we get to that? Uh, how do we get to that capacity, ah, of trusting that the client really is the expert in their own situation? And what shows up for the client? When you think about the people that you’ve worked with and you’ve had successful engagements with. What is the evolution that they go through through that coaching process where they’re allowed to really evolve as a human being, as a leader, as an executive, as a visionary? What shifts for them that you see from your external position?

Mike Green

They’re usually very far out of alignment and congruence. And I say leadership truth. Right. They’re leadership truth, which ultimately melts into their life truth. Right. Um, truth. Some people might call them values. Um, I currently have my book would be seven because I went to seven, I worked on seven continents, but it could be the four key truths. So they’re so far out of congruence, and as you bring them towards congruence, then they realize that their decision-making is far easier. Or far, um, more natural. And they have a far better outcome because people know they’re coming from a place of, uh, for example, care and concern, or, um, I’m putting labels on it, but they’re coming from a place of altruism or whatever have you. So their experience is far far better than coming out of a place of scarcity, fear, um, anger, um, hope, right? All these things, um, I support them in that. So they go from a place of doing what got them where they are today, thinking it’s going to support them where they need to go tomorrow. And there’s usually the angst is where they’re not congruent. And I support them in that congruence of marrying or bringing together who they truly are. They got them where they are today and where they really want to be because they ultimately have that inside them. Steven Pressfield calls it their muse, right? You follow him, talks about your muse. Your muse is that inner beauty or inner self that really wants them, knows what it wants, but we get in the way of it. That’s what he talks about. Um, that’s why my Adventure Coaching is so powerful, because people come to me and we go somewhere where there’s no Internet. There’s no sense that they truly get down to their truth of what’s important and why do they do what they do. And how are they going to go off and do that, and how can I support them?

Lyssa deHart

Yeah. And I imagine and I’m guessing here, so correct me if I’m wrong, um, but I’m imagining also, for many people, the idea of getting into the wild and not having your cell phone and not having maybe electricity and not having a lot of the things that you’re not having when you’re out in the bush. Um, and really being with yourself. Um, I can imagine there’s the fear that is sort of innate in that as a first-time experience for somebody, but also the power of learning to actually be with yourself with that discomfort. You’re laughing. What just showed up?

Mike Green

Oh, boy. Uh, I love that coaching questions. So what just showed up for you? Well, I just think of all the videos play in my mind, of all people, the first thing they do is they grab their cell phone and realize that, oh, my God, we’re really out here. I don’t even have them bring their phones anymore. I give them a camera to take pictures with. They just look for that stimuli, and all of a sudden, they have to realize they have to be themselves. Right. And my tagline is, if you will, is I believe that Leaders are formed in the Wild. Now, the wild can be the bush of Alaska. It could be the wild of a corporate boardroom. It could be the wild and a crucial conversation with somebody because ultimately leaving a place of safety or normalcy to use, um, Joseph Campbell’s work to stepping into the unknown. The unknown is a learning experience. Correct. So that can be considered wild. Right. So, um, when people go through that experience in the wild or in the bush of Alaska or, um, wherever I take them in the world or meet them in the world. They really begin to understand or start to relearn or accustomed to themselves again. Because those distractions of tik tok or emails or LinkedIn and all this are gone now. So now we go. So now what? I don’t let them go into a book and you’ll hide. They have to do themselves. I put them on a solo for 24 hours or maybe two days, depending on their schedule. Um, and they really have to be by themselves with an intention an intention. So for crucial conversations, how do you want to show up for your family and your leadership team in the next year? What’s it going to look like? What conversations you want to be having with me a year from now? Say, Mike, when you put me on that solo, we went onto the bush of Alaska. I didn’t know if my marriage was going to make it, but now I know that it was all worth. Putting in the hard work, because now my wife and I, myself and I are having a better relationship. My kids and I know my kids and kids friends, and they “let me” pick them up at school, and they “let me” drop them off. That’s what I have. What we ultimately do is that intention. And you can only do that by getting away from the distractions. And I just had a female client, um, come out with me, and she’s leaving one chapter over her life because she believes, and I believe it as well in order to arrive well in the next chapter of your life, you have to leave well, so you can arrive well. Uh, she came to me in the bush of Alaska as part of her Capstone Experience or Alaska Leadership Adventure, because she just was going to leave her company that she started with her partner. Leave that well and go on to another organization, uh, that can better support her drive of supporting people with neurotrauma. Um, and she’s a doctor of research, so it’s pretty interesting to see her transformation that takes place there because it supersedes everything when you go out and get away from the distractions.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah. And I really think there’s something about actually being in the wilderness. But I also like something that you said based on the work of Joseph Campbell in that, uh, anytime we step into that space of not knowing, anytime we step into the discomfort, in some ways, we’re stepping into “the wild. ” And we have an opportunity, whether we leave our house, to do it or not, even if it’s just sort of an, uh, internal experience that we’re having where we’re challenging ourselves and some of the ways that we’re thinking or to your point, where we’re in or out of alignment on things that we say are important to us. It’s an opportunity in many ways to be brave in the wild, um, and in that new landscape that we are moving towards or through. And I also just really want to put a pen in this because I think it’s so crucial, which is how we leave one chapter of our life before we move into the next. I don’t know if you remember Buckaroo Banzai, but “no matter where you go, there you are, right? ” Like, if you have baggage here, you drag that baggage with you to the next experience. If you don’t clean it up, uh, and leave it where it needs to be left. Right. Um, yeah.

Mike Green

I’ve had clients literally write themselves a letter, on top of a mountain, whether it be raining or not. I give them a tarp, and they literally write themselves. And they go up there with the intention they literally go up the top of that peak with the intention that they’re going to leave that baggage behind. And then I tell them, Bury it, leave it up there. And they come down and they take a long time getting down. And I was thinking, why are they taking so long? Um, to get down that trail is pretty easy. Come on. I can do it. However minute. They’re so emotional when they come down. It just gives me chills of thinking about how. I’m honored to be that person that allows it, gives them that opportunity because they really come down emotionally, literally, metaphorically, and physically brains and come down from that, and then they move forward. And I tell you, a year from then, we’re still talking. They’re saying, that was one of the best things ever in my life. Thank you so much, Mike, because of these reasons. Don’t thank me, thank you. Then when we had that moment of I just want you to sit for a moment and we want to just thank yourself, and they just lose it. I lose it. We all lose it. Such a powerful experience to put a point, uh, to add another pin to that, if you will.

Lyssa deHart

Yeah. And there’s something powerful about letting go of the things that are weighing us down. Um, it’s a hard thing to change a habit, even if the habit is an unconscious habit that we’ve had for our whole life of, um, that particular piece of baggage that we’ve been carrying around. To set it down and leave it. It’s a grieving process, I think, that we have to go through along with the freedom that it invites as we have more energy or strength to move forward in a different direction, without carrying that weight upon us. Um. I think that’s, I really love that you brought this forward because I really think that’s such a pivotal part of any really good work that people are doing with other human beings is to create this space of safety where people have that permission to set down things. But also to experience the catharsis that maybe as part of letting. Uh. Go of something and leaving it on top of that mountain. So to say.

Mike Green

Yeah. I have them do it in different ways in the outdoors. In the wilderness. And, um, there’s always this powerful, um, it’s so important they give themselves permission to do that and really do it. And, um, sometimes if they’re going to the top of the mountain, as, ah, you leave you’re leaving it, as you get closer to the bottom, it’s a new beginning. And, um, how can I support you in that idea? They’re usually really silent for a long time after that. Um, usually we embrace and then we go across a small stream and then we hike back to the camp. And I usually have a fire going and they usually sit by the campfire, and sometimes they sob. Sometimes they rejoice, they dance around. I mean, I’ve had a conversation about it’s like dances with wolves and dancing around. Some of them do that. Other ones sob because they just so cathartic. They just let it go.

Lyssa deHart

Uh, and that relief is so important, right? Like, getting that out of your system and honoring it is so crucial to the journey as well. I don’t know, I’m guessing here about myself, but, um, I’ve spent some time in the wilderness without cell phones and, um, not like you have done, but I’ve definitely spent time on my own. Um, I think I’m a dance around the fire kind of person I think.

Mike Green

Yeah, that’s great. So however you want to do it. Again, Alaska Leadership Adventures or Global Leadership Adventures as well, are just one thing that I do. I work with people via Zoom still. A lot of my clients are still doing that, et cetera. And I go to lower 48 with clients. I just got off a call before this one is going to Miami. Um, which is nice because this is, uh, getting cold up here in September to meet with the client. So these adventures we talk about, you don’t have to come with me. You don’t have to go with anyone. Just leave your phone and go for a hike or go for a walk around your town and just observe people. I, ah, always tell people, you don’t have to go all the way up here if you don’t want to. Yes, Alaska is amazing, but if you really want to find that congruence, give yourself a gift of being away from that electronic device, um, and notice what it does for you.

Lyssa deHart

Once a coach always a coach.

Mike Green

We just have this jam going of all these fun, um, um, cooking conversations, right?

Lyssa deHart

Yeah, it’s true, there are some of those, but they really do support the awareness. Right. And in some ways, that’s why we do these particular kinds of questions as they do support awareness. And so… If you were talking to a new coach, or a coach thinking about moving, not a new coach necessarily, but a coach that’s really wanting to move towards MCC, what is something that, um, you would offer them as, I don’t know, a waypoint or an idea to consider? I know you had mentioned earlier about like what is your, how do you want to be in relationship to the MCC, but is there any other bit of wisdom you might share with a coach wanting to move towards MCC?

Mike Green

Just had this conversation yesterday in a parking lot in Fairbanks. They were calling, uh, me from Colorado. Um, several things. One, the value of transcribing a coaching call is exponential.

Lyssa deHart

It cannot be underrated. It cannot be underrated.

Mike Green

Yes. Don’t use the ah, app. I said, you’ll be doing yourself as a service. Make a commitment to yourself that you’re going to do it three times, maybe five times, and I guarantee you, and I even hate to say the word guarantee. You will, it’ll be very painful, it was painful for me. It was very painful. But I learned so much. And my coaching calls went from, uh, being at this level to the next level within the first time I did a full coaching call. I said, listen, do yourself a favor though. Don’t do a whole-hour call. Because for me, an hour [30 minutes] call took about three or four hours. Do yourself a favor, find somebody a pro bono. Can we just have a call for 30 to 40 minutes? And whatever takes place in it is of value to you and I. Is that okay? Even if you have to get outside the parameters of anything because the value is listening to your question. And then feeling the pain of the that, I can’t believe I asked that question. You can’t even give a chance and you’re just self coaching as you’re typing is arduous then, right? It’s almost like you’re in Ben Hur, keeps with the or your Charlton Heston. Just like, oh, this sucks. Right? So do that. I would really encourage that, number one. Number two, get in a relationship with a mentor early. Don’t think you have to do it for the 10 hours. And how much is this going to cost? Find somebody you can work with. Or find a group and I would encourage you to find the right group, not just a bunch of folks. And I’m not saying this is negative. Find people with an intention. What is your intention of hiring them? I, ah, just want somebody to help me up my game. Right. Not game, but I hate to say it that way, but I would do that. Those are the first two things I would do. And the third thing is enjoy the process. Because if you really want to be a Master, it is a process. Uh, there’s no milestone other than when you finally get that email after 18 weeks, you’re like, oh my m God, 18 weeks later. Right? And sleepless nights after sleepless nights. Because it’s an ongoing journey. So enjoy the journey. And if you’re doing it for a milestone, I encourage you to, uh, rethink that. Reevaluate?

Lyssa deHart

Yeah. I do see it as a milestone, but I see it as just a mile marker more than anything. That the journey continues far past whatever that number is. Um, most highways have more than 10 miles on them. Most, um, have more than 100. So it’s a journey of a lifetime, I agree with you. Um, so what are you passionately involved in right now? What would you like to share with the audience that you’re up to, ah, and feeling excited about?

Mike Green

Well, other than being the best husband and father I can be, a neighbor and things like that. Well, um, I’m in the interior of Alaska currently. That’s where my family and I live full-time. We, um, moved back from Saudi Arabia to Alaska. I was working as, uh, an executive coach there for two and a half years. We love Alaska. I loved a lot I’ve had a relationship with Alaska for 25 years. Um, I just love being outdoors, doing projects. We bought a homestead that was built in 1958. So there’s a lot of projects going on. I love being outdoors. I’m about to go on a major expedition, uh, tomorrow morning for seven days. So I’m looking forward to that. Uh, I’m doing a lot of, uh, doing some great reading right now. I’m reading an awesome book called Driven by Dr. Doug Brackman. So if you have any clients or if you’re afflicted having a spouse, that is very driven. It’s a great book. I love the book. I’m reading it for the third time. Um, grateful for that. Just enjoying the fruits of the labor that my wife and I and our journey together has brought forward to us. Um, I’m very lucky to be well scheduled, so, um, I’m just enjoying that because I put a lot of time and effort and a lot of hours and days away from my family, unfortunately, at the beginning of their life. So I’m doing my best to be part of their life as much as possible. I drive them to school 40 miles to the north and drop them off and pick them back up 40 miles to the north at the end of the day. So that’s what I’m doing.

Lyssa deHart

Brilliant. brilliant. And as we come to a close here today, my final question and doesn’t need an explanation, but I’m really curious, if you were to write your autobiography today, what would the title be?

Mike Green

Mmm well, WanderMust is kind of like a beginning of it all, but if I was to write my autobiography it would be, Small Town Boy Creates Big Time Service. No, Big Time Global Service. Is that too long of a title?

Lyssa deHart

I don’t know. I think it’s a beautiful title.

Mike Green

That’s a great question. Thank you for asking.

Lyssa deHart

Is that sort of like, how can we come up with our title? Thank you so much for being on the coaching studio today. I have really very much enjoyed our conversation today.

Mike Green

It’s been great. Thank you. It’s so much fun, isn’t it? It was a fun call. People might think, my God, he’s a lot of fun. How can you be a Master Coach while jamming having two coaches having a great conversation? But we know when it comes time for the coaching conversation that I’m….

Lyssa deHart

Getting to have fun guy today. So we appreciate that. Thank you again so much.

Mike Green

I’m grateful. Huge honor to be here today. I’m grateful.

Lyssa deHart

As am I. Thank you.

 

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Lyssa deHart, LICSW, MCC

Lyssa deHart, LICSW, MCC

Host

Lyssa deHart ditched her therapy practice to become a Leadership Confidence Coach. Along the way she discovered a passion for professional coaching and wanted to find ways to share that passion with the world. Come join her in discovering and meeting some of the most amazing professional coaches on the planet. Her goal is to inspire coaches. Lyssa is the author of StoryJacking: Change Your Dialogue, Transform Your Life , and The Reflective Coach. Lyssa is an ICF PCC Assessor, Certified Mentor Coach, and budding Coach SuperVisor. Lyssa uses her understanding of the ICF Core Competencies, combined with her knowledge of Neuroscience, to work with people to become extraordinary professional coaches. Let's Go!

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